Exposing Alex Jones' Mistaken View of Posttrib Onlyism

Alex Jones accused those who believe in a rapture before the Tribulation of not fighting evil and accusing certain evil men in history of being the Antichrist. Why would not Christians who believe there is a rapture before the Tribulation not fight evil? We can speculate on who the Antichrist would be, but don't posttribber onlyists do the same?

The Bible doesn't say there is a rapture according to readiness at the first rapture before the Tribulation? If "thou didst keep the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of trial, that hour which is to come upon the whole world, to try them that dwell upon the earth" (Rev. 3.10). God can't make such a promise when the saints are in the Tribulation since there will be many martyrs of the saints during the Tribulation.

"Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man" (Luke 21.36). So again we see the first rapture is according to readiness, not for the whole Church just those who are watchful and prayerful. Do all Christians do this? No, so only some will be raptured alive at the first rapture "before the throne" (Rev. 7.9) before the first trumpet of the Tribulation (8.7ff) commences.

Those who reject the first rapture according to readiness obviously will be excluded from it since they try to take away the hope of the Church, for with the hope of the return of Jesus is the hope of escaping the hour of trial and be received unto Him if we are prayerful and watchful.

Here is where it gets interesting. Alex Jones will accuse the saints who are raptured at the first rapture as a "fake rapture." There won't be many, just about 2 or 3 million who are raptured alive, so Alex Jones will be like Satan accusing the brethren day and night (Rev. 12.10). Is Alex a Christian? Probably not. He is waiting for the Antichrist for in his posttrib only view, necessarily the Antichrist must come first.

William Hammond said there is no reference to a pretrib rapture until recently. That's not so. From various quotes either specific or otherwise, you can see many taught there was is a rapture before the Tribulation such as Ephraem, Clement of Rome, Shepherd of Hermas and Victorinus to name a few. There were many others. Posttrib onlyists simply shut their minds down to this fact, while Christians (partial rapture believers) don't shut their minds down to there being those of the posttrib onlyists persuasion throughout the centuries also.

Hammond continues in error, misusing this verse: "And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. " (Matt. 24.31). He said this is the rapture of the saints. He is wrong. At this point Jesus has already stepped down on the mount of olives, so it wouldn't make much sense this elect are the saints, since we see at least some of the saints "before the throne" (Rev. 7.9) in heaven as in other verses as well (also see 11.1,15; 12.5, 14.1-5, 15.2-4). Jesus returns with His saints (Jude 14,15), not to gather them. Rather, He gathers the elect who have been scattered because the European Union and United States have taken over Jerusalem after their conquest of Iran.

Matt. 24.31 This verse is the fulfillment of Matthew 23.39: “Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord”—After the Great Tribulation, the Lord will “gather together His elect”: the “elect” or “chosen” are the Jews who are scattered among the nations. “From the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other”—This does not denote rapture, for here it is the idea of erchomai, not parousia. Here is a gathering together (see Deut. 30.3-5).

"That then the LORD thy God will turn thy captivity, and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath scattered thee. If [any] of thine be driven out unto the outmost [parts] of heaven, from thence will the LORD thy God gather thee, and from thence will he fetch thee: And the LORD thy God will bring thee into the land which thy fathers possessed, and thou shalt possess it; and he will do thee good, and multiply thee above thy fathers" (Deut. 30.3-5).

After the destruction of Jerusalem, the Jews were either killed or captured. They were scattered to the nations. Now, the Lord begins to call them back (see Is. 43.5-7). They shall return from the east, the west, the north, and the south. Some shall even come from the land of Sinim (Is. 49.9-13). Now Sinim means China, and in Hunan province there is a large number of Jews, who, incidentally, take the family name of Tsan. See also Isaiah 49.22-26, 51.11, 56.8, 60.4, 62.10-12, 27.13; Ezekiel 34.13, 37.21, 28.25. “From the four winds”—Wind is moving all the time: the Jews have no settled place in which to live but wander all over the world.

The gathering spoken of here is not the rapture of the church, because (1) parousia has already passed, and rapture is within the scope of parousia; (2) this is a gathering together, and hence it has no connection with parousia; (3) if it were indeed parousia it would be totally foreign to the meaning of the preceding passage (rapture is not a gathering and "all the tribes mourn" v.30); (4) by it pointing to the Jews it agrees with Matthew 23.37, "how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under [her] wings, and ye would not!"; (5) at the trump of God, the Lord would come to the air (last trumpet before the bowls are poured, 1 Cor. 15.23,50-52, 1 Thess. 4.15-17, Rev. 11.15, 12.5, 14.1-5); and (6) the context proves to be concerning the Jews.

Hammond also erred in saying the marriage supper of the lamb is in heaven. No it's not. The marriage supper of the lamb for the 5 wise virgins get to enter is the millennial reign of Christ on earth. No need to spirtualize this. Hammond tried to reinterpret Matt. 24.37,40-42: "But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two [women shall be] grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come." Hammond says Noah wasn't raptured out of the world. Sure he was. He entered the ark and thus, was taken out of the world, but notice his being taken out of the world was not just because he was saved, but because of his good works, so he was accounted worthy to escape the hour of trial. He was watchful and thus was not left to pass through the Tribulation. How is it a good work of posttrib onlyists to alter God's word or enters wars that were not His will?

Then Alex Jones says a five year old could understand. Then why doesn't Alex understand? He says saints will be persecuted in the Tribulation so how can the Church be raptured before the Tribulation? Alex doesn't understand partial rapture, that the first rapture is just the overcomer believers just like only one of the seven churches (Rev. 2 & 3) was considered to have "ovecometh" (mentioned 27 times in Rev. 2 & 3). Therefore, only 1/7th of those alive at the first rapture who are saved are raptured alive. And the rest of the Church are left to pass through the time of testing. So many who profess to be Christians can't see accountability for believers. All they see are saved and unsaved. They don't see how they might not be as overassuming as pretrib onlyists they are equally faulty,

http://www3.telus.net/trbrooks/Partial_rapture#posttrib

Mark Quarante throws in his two cents and says, if you are going to be jettisoned out then you don't have to do anything. That would be true if it were true, but it is not, since according to partial rapture, you are only jettisoned out if you keep the word of His patience, are prayerful and watchful, keep the conduct of Matthew 5-7 and allow God to divide your spirit, soul and body, walking firmly in the Holy Spirit. If you want to remain a carnal Christian by all means go ahead and exclude yourself from the first rapture, but don't blame those saints who were raptured alive at the first rapture, for surely you will lose the reward of returning to reign with Christ during the 1000 years. Mark gets more obnoxious and says, give him your money if you think there is a first rapture. Why should those who are seeking to be first raptured like Paul to win the prize give money to evil men? Mark states further it is a "copout". Is it a copout to seek to overcometh? It is though a copout to harden your heart, seeking the Antichrist first, and hardening your flesh for the Tribulation, denying the Scriptures, and moving ahead of God's will, thus disqualifying yourself from the first rapture. Men love their own prowess, not God's guiding and leading of Spirit. Even in matters of worshiping God men pretentious presume to know His will when they don't because they circumvent His word.

Alex Jones says those who believe in a first rapture are cowards and in denial. Yet the verses were given there is a first rapture according to readiness. Is not then Alex being a coward and in denial since he is relying on his own strength and disqualifying himself from the first rapture and the hope of the Church? Think of the loss that will come upon Alex Jones for he will be cast into "outer darkness" for 1000 years before the New City commences. That is a long time to the lose the reward of being with Christ during the millennium. He will be weeping and gnashing his teeth in regret that before he had not an earth to hear these words.

Are posttribber onlyists heretics? Perhaps quite of few of them are, though some might be saved, but they shall lose the reward of not just the first rapture but also of returning with Christ to reign during the 1000 years.

Mark makes the mistake of taking Matt. 24.38 as being the flood, but that is not what Matt. 24 says. It says, "For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark" (v.38). This is very similar to Luke 21.34: "And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares." This is referring to the whole Tribulation, the whole of Daniel's last seven which speaks of a "flood" (Dan. 9.26c-27). Alex Jones loves his worldly program.

So do you see, this is not in the flood but before the flood. Hence, we are to be watchful because Jesus comes like a thief in the night. We would not want for Him to break into our homes unaware. Jesus come to to steal the best, the overcomers. The Church can't beat the Antichrist-we can only do so much. Do not presume we can do more than we can do! That's why God separates state and Church. Do not go against God's will on this matter.

The "taken" and the "left" are both Christians since Matt. 24.32-Matt. 25.30 is talking about Christians. Why be watchful to be left? Be watchful to be taken. Just as 1 Thess. 4.15-17 points out those who are "alive" and "left" would be redundant, for obviously those who are alive are left, so it must be referring to those who are "left" who were not "taken" beforehand. A much more deeper analysis of the "taken" and the "left" shows them both to be a Christians in the entire context of Matthew 24 & 25.

http://www3.telus.net/trbrooks/Matthew_24#taken

The one who is left is a Christian, but he is a carnal Christian, tied down to the world, relying on self-strength. He thinks he can do what he really can't do. He is proud. He is pretentious and a lover of the world, tied down to it like a balloon unwilling to be released. He is lying on a bed of fornication. He argues with pretribbers. They take away the hope of the Church and exalt themselves. They also lose the reward of returning with Christ to reign during the 1000 years. “Your Lord cometh” (v.42) speaks to both first raptured and later raptured saints since Jesus is the Lord of both the taken and the left.

Judging from typology, those who are left can be the saved as well as those who are taken. Both Enoch (who was raptured) and Noah (who entered the ark) were saved. Yet both Abraham (the intercessor) and Lot (who passed through tribulation) were saved too. But Elijah (the taken) and Elisha (the left) were saved. The disciples whom the Lord in His ascension left behind were all saved ones. Both Philip (the one taken away) and the eunuch (the one left behind) were saved.

“Watch therefore” (v.42). The word “therefore” connects with the preceding verses 40 and 41. Since you are saved and have life, you are expected to watch. Those who lack the Lord’s life cannot watch. The determining factor in rapture is not a being saved or unsaved but is a case of one’s works after regeneration. To say that all the regenerated will be raptured together is a serious mistake.

“The thief was coming” (v.43). If a thief comes to steal apples, he will take the ripe ones and leave the unripened ones behind. Thus it is not a difference in kind but one of degree. As T. Austin Sparks once said, "there are advanced parties and harbingers in every sphere." Rev. 14.1-5 is the firstfruits then comes the later harvest (vv.14-16).

The accusations get weirder. Mark Quarante says you have to throw out your Christian teaching to believe the rapture before the Tribulation. You do? Is not the word of God clear, there are some raptured alive "before the throne" (Rev. 7.9) before the Tribulation trumpets (8.7ff)? Why must we reject the cross to accept this? I for one am spiritually motivated that if I overcometh in Christ I will be received at the first rapture, for God keeps His promises. Death is no blessing.

He accuses the first rapture believers of claiming we have no strength? Well of course we have strength, but we certainly can't defeat the Antichrist without Jesus returning. Think about that. Satan works so hard because he wants every last soul he can get into Hell even to deceive the body of Christ if that were possible. He has deceived posttribber onlyists because they exclude themselves from the first rapture and the reign of the millennium. What Alex, William and Mark are doing is trying to win a war they can't win. Therefore, what they are doing is vain and superficial. Instead of preparing their temples for rapture, they are looking for another war they can't win.

Consequently they enter into false battles, invade countries they shouldn't invade and act like the Spanish Inquisition, Crusades and like that murderous Protestant Pope of Geneva, John Calvin.

Just as these three posttriber onlyists are wrong, so is Ken Layhey in his Left Behind Series, since the first rapture is according to readiness, not a forgone conclusion for the whole Church.

William Hammond adds in his last two cents and says, pridefully, arrogantly, what fear do we have to fight the good fight and so forth. To which I reply, how are you fighting the good fight in your fearlessness if you are fighting a fight God never authorized you to enter? God never asked you to do that thing you claim is His will. He never told you to invade that country. Shame on you! You are acting like the Roman Church. He closes by saying something about demons because saints pray instead of doing something active. Sometimes that's all you can do is pray. What God hates the most is when you move ahead of His leading and this is what posttrib onlyists are doing, and that is why so many problems occur in the world.

Our prayers go out to both the unsaved as well as saved posttrib onlyists for they know not what they do.

In summary, the problems with postrib onlyism:

A. Were the entire body of believers to be raptured after the Tribulation, there would again be no need for us to watch and wait and be prepared. Knowing that the Lord would not come before the end of the three and a half year's period, we could live evilly up to three years five months and twenty-nine days. Yet such a concept violates the very principle of the Scriptures.

B. Were all of us believers to be raptured after the Great Tribulation, then our waiting would not be a waiting for Christ but for the Antichrist, since the latter must come first.

C. The church would lose her hope - “Looking for the blessed hope and appearing of the glory of the great God and our Savior Jesus Christ” (Titus 2.13) - for included in this hope is the blessing of escaping the Tribulation.

D. The second school of interpretation does not accept the idea of a secret rapture; yet its followers forget the word, “Behold, I come as a thief” (Rev. 16.15). A thief comes secretly, is never preceded by a band, and always steals the best.

E. This second school views the twelve disciples as being purely Christians in direct contrast with the view of the first school which considers these twelve as being merely Jews. As a matter of fact, however, these twelve disciples are Christians as well as representatives of the Jewish remnant. For example, in Matthew 10.5-6 and 23.3 we see that all have a Jewish background, a fact which is thus inapplicable to Christians.

F. There is a failure in this second school to distinguish between rapture and the appearing of the Lord. There is a difference between Christ coming for the saints and Christ coming with the saints. That which Enoch prophesied, as recorded in Jude, points to the coming of the Lord, "with his holy myriads” (see Jude 14-15 mg.) when His feet step down on the Mount of Olives. So does the prophecy which is given in Revelation: “Behold, he cometh with the clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they that pierced him; and all the tribes of the earth shall mourn over him. Even so, Amen” (1.7). In taking the historical view, the second school of interpretation regards that part of Revelation up to chapter 17 as having already been fulfilled, with only the part from chapter 17 onward waiting to be fulfilled. (This is exactly opposite to the futuristic view taken by the first school of interpretation which deems only chapters 1-3 as having already been fulfilled, with the rest remaining to be so). If the book of Revelation only records primarily things of the past, then how can the average child of God ever understand it? It would require doctors of philosophy and learned historians to comprehend it! Furthermore, it would no longer be revelation either!

Questions raised against separate rapture, and answers thereto, are submitted below.

A. Some people say that the rapture of the church cannot be divided because the body of Christ cannot be divided. It should be noted in reply, however, that the body is a figure of speech which signifies one life. If the body is taken literally, then there is already division today because the Lord is now in heaven, Paul has already died, we remain living on earth, and some believers are yet to be born.

B. Others object that rapture is part of redemption, that since redemption is according to grace, rapture cannot be based on the concept of worthiness. In reply, it needs to be pointed out that while the act of changing (see 1 Cor. 15.51-52) is indeed according to grace, the act of being taken (rapture) is according to works.

C. Some observers ask, is it not rather cruel to take away hope from the church? To which we must answer that in the Scriptures there is no such false hope given; and therefore it is better to alert people to this fact.

D. I Corinthians 15.23, say some, only mentions “they that are Christ’s” and that nothing is said about works. But let us be aware that this verse does not speak of rapture, it speaks of resurrection.

E. Since the dead will not go through the Great Tribulation, would it not be unfair to the living for them to go through it? Will not the righteous God be unjust in this regard? In response, let me say that we do need to be concerned; for during the millennium each and every believer (including all believers who died prior to the Great Tribulation) will receive, as a consequence of appearing before Christ’s judgment seat, the things done in the body while alive, according to what he has done whether it be good or bad (2 Cor. 5.10).

F. Since in 1 Cor. 15:50-52 (“We all shall not sleep, but we shall all be changed”) “all” is the word used, surely this signifies the whole body. Yes, the “all” here does indeed refer to the entire body, but it does not have reference to the same time. For example, we all will die, but certainly not all of us will do so in one day.

G. There is a distinction made in the Bible between wheat and tares, some say, but no difference made between wheat and wheat; consequently, all wheat must be raptured. In reply, it should be noted that the times of ripening for wheat are not the same. Thus there are the firstfruits and the later harvest.

H. Some argue that according to I Thessalonians 4.15, the living “shall in no wise precede them who are fallen asleep” -The dead are resurrected at the seventh trumpet; and so timewise, rapture occurs after the Tribulation. Now if there is a first rapture, it will have to take place before the resurrection of the dead. But since this verse distinctly says “shall in no wise,” how then can rapture take place twice? Let me say in reply that it is most precious and significant to find in both verse 15 and verse 17 the qualifying clauses “we that are alive, that are left” - Now to be alive is obviously to be left on earth; why, then, is there this apparent unnecessary repetition? Because it implies that there are people who though alive yet have already gone ahead (that is, raptured) and therefore are no longer left on earth. Would Paul enlist himself among this class of people who are alive and are left? Not at all. He uses the word “we” only because he is speaking at that moment of writing, and the proof of this is that since Paul no longer lives today, he cannot be numbered among those who are left on earth. Our summary conclusion to all this is that the third school of interpretation seems to be the correct one - that is to say, that one group of believers will be raptured before the Tribulation while another group of believers will go through the Tribulation and be raptured afterwards.

Further evidence for partial rapture:

Revelation 3.10 “The hour of trial, that hour which is to come upon the whole world” - This is the Great Tribulation. This verse tells us that a certain class of people may escape the Great Tribulation, even those who keep the word of the patience of Christ. Instantly it tears apart the arguments of the second school of interpretation as well as those of the first. Although Philadelphia represents the true church in the dispensation of Grace, it is nonetheless only one of the seven local churches in Asia at that time. Thus it shows that only a relatively small number of people (one seventh) may be raptured before the Tribulation. Furthermore, pre-tribulation rapture is not based purely on our being born again as children of God, but is dependent on one other condition, which is, our keeping the word of the patience of Christ. Do all believers today keep the word of the patience of Christ? Obviously not. It is therefore evident that not the whole body of believers will be raptured before the Tribulation. The second school contends, however, that this passage of Scripture does not refer to pre-tribulation rapture, for it speaks of keeping - that God will “keep” them safely through the Great Tribulation: just as, for example, when an entire house is caught on fire, one room may be left untouched; or for example, when the land of Egypt came under the plague, the land of Goshen where the children of Israel dwelt in Egypt went unscathed (see Ex. 9.26, 10.23). Such an explanation is erroneous because (1) the “keeping” in view here is not a keeping through but a keeping from. In the Greek text, after the word “keep” in this verse there is the word ek which means “out of’ (as in the word ekklesia which means “the called out ones”). Here, therefore, ek signifies a being kept out of the Tribulation. And (2) “Because thou didst keep the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of trial” (3.10a) - As we have seen, the trial which is to come upon the whole world is the Great Tribulation; but notice that it is not a keeping from the trial but a keeping from the hour of the trial, In order to be kept out of the hour of trial, we must leave the world. There are only two ways for God to keep us out: death and rapture. And hence part of the living will be raptured before the Tribulation.

B. Luke 21.36 also proves that not the entire church but only a part of it will be raptured before the Tribulation. The accounts of Luke 21 and Matthew 24 are quite alike, except that Matthew stresses more the coming of Christ and the Tribulation while Luke focuses more on the destruction of Jerusalem and the Tribulation. Hence there is the famous question asked in Matthew (24.3), and there are also more parables recorded in Matthew’s account than in Luke’s. In 70 A.D. Jerusalem experienced a terrible destruction, and at the end she will experience a great tribulation. The record in Luke can be outlined as follows: 2 1.8-9 - the things before the end; 10-19 - believers will suffer; 20-28 - how Jerusalem will be destroyed (verse 28 seems to suggest that the saints will all pass through the Tribulation); 29-33 - a parable guaranteeing the certainty of these things to come; and 34-36 - Were it not for this passage, it might be inferred that the whole body of believers would surely be raptured after the Tribulation: yet verse 34 has a change in tone from the preceding verses, verse 35 shows that the things mentioned earlier concern the whole inhabited world, and verse 36 presents the condition for escaping the Great Tribulation - which is to watch and pray. How are believers to escape all these coming things and to stand before the Son of man? Naturally by being raptured. Death is not a blessing: we do not pray and expect death. The condition here for rapture is to watch and pray. Hence here, not all the regenerated may be raptured. Pray always. What to pray for? Pray that we may escape all these things which shall come to pass. “That ye may prevail” (or, “ye may be accounted worthy” AV), It is not a question of grace, but rather a matter of worthiness. How about worthiness? God cannot receive you to the place where you have no desire to go. Some people may consider heaven as too tasteless a place in which to live as may be indicated by these words: “Lest haply your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life” (v.34). If a balloon is tied, it cannot ascend. In sum, Luke 21.36 shatters the arguments of both the first and second schools of interpretation. The second school may still raise other arguments, such as (1) that rapture is not dependent on conduct - yet in reply it should be asked whether anyone thinks a carnal believer lying on a bed of fornication will be raptured? Or (2) that the phrase “all these things” does not refer to the Great Tribulation but to the surfeiting, drunkenness, and cares of this life cited in verse 34. In reply, it should be noted that verse 36 reads, “all these things that shall come to pass" - whereas “surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life” pertain to the things which are present now. And therefore, “watch ye” means to not be deceived by such activities.
C. Other proofs as follows:

(1) By reading Matthew 24.42 together with 1 Thessalonians 5.2, 4, it is evident that there are at least two raptures: for note that the first passage suggests rapture before the Tribulation because one must be watchful since he does not know when his Lord will come; while the second passage suggests rapture after the Tribulation because one knows when the day of the Lord shall come.

(2) The places to be raptured towards are also different. Whereas Revelation 7.15 mentions to “the throne of God” and Luke 21.36 mentions “to stand before the Son of man”, 1 Thessalonians 4.17 says that it is to “the air” – Such distinctions would thus indicate that the entire body of believers is not raptured all at one time.

(3) Mark 13 states, “But of that day or that hour knoweth no one, not even the angels in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father” (v.32), So that the day of the coming of Christ is unknown. But 1 Thessalonians 4 declares that “the Lord himself shall descend from heaven, with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God” (v.16). From this second passage we know that the appearing of Christ is after the sounding of the seventh trumpet. And hence the first passage relates to pre-tribulation rapture while the second relates to post-tribulation rapture.

To discuss, go here.

Troy Brooks (some quotes by Watchman Nee, CFP white covers only)